Yes, it's standard. A sample MRE would contain:

Noodles
Bread
Napkin
Green Beans
Saltine Crackers
Butter

The media might report "They are dropping Napkins and crackers! The Afghans don't need that!" However, what they don't report is that they always contain basic foods, and jam and penut butter as a side snack.

A moist towelet for MEAT???? -=LOL=-
Ummm, in case you didn't know (which i hope you didn't) the MREs we are dropping are vegetarian to conform with Muslim diet laws, yes everything else in the list is standard in what we drop, but we do not send any meat.

Since I guess no Muslim laws prohibit suicide and murder, why don't these Arab leaders declare war on terrorism???

We should take the humanitarian aid as a carrot to these countries untill they hand over these terrorists.

I hear that the generals have authorized lethal force against bin Laden and co. ; guys, lets wait til we get there!

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Victory has a thousand fathers, but defeat is an orphan.

No clue who the guy pictured in my avatar is, but its a great picture nonetheless!

on the news they said they dont no what certain food is and hey much rather have rice and beans

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Everybodys Doing the Fish! Yeah! Yeah! Yeah!-Reel Big Fish

Trust me, we are dropping tons(really) of Rice and Beans.

i say put a bomb in some bean soup and drop it in an obvious place for taliban to intercept it.

I don't think we will ever get Bin Laden. back about 10 yrs ago one of bin laden's assistants needed to escape a country so he had plastic surgery and he walked right out of the country. so Bin Laden could of got surgery and be living in the US right now.

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Go Reds!!!!!

I agree. The guy is head of a huge terrorist organisation, so whatever you think of him/it, they have got a heck of a lot of resources at their disposal. Also, I recall everyone saying at the start of the Gulf War how Saddam Hussein was going to be killed, and he's still around. The same goes for Colonel Gaddafi (sp?).

On a second note, I think the USA needs to be a bit more careful with what it's bombing. Another Red Cross depot was hit last night - I think that's the third or fourth that has been hit, destroying thousands of tons of much-needed food. Also, I've just watched a Sky News report of a village that was bombed, killing 15 civilians and injuring dozens more, including a couple of children who had limbs blown off.

I'm sure these are accidents, after all, if you drop thousands of bombs a few are going to go astray, but if this carries on then countries such as Pakistan, who have supported the US so far, will perhaps start to have second thoughts.

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Andy Rathe

Saddam would have been easy to get at. In fact, he's easy to get at RIGHT NOW. Thing about the persian gulf war was that Bush Sr. made the decision to halt the campaign after Saddam had left Kuwait. Why? a: the US felt the objectives of preventing Iraqi expansion was met, b: we didn't have the coalition behind us for a full-scale overthrow of Saddam, and c: we didn't want to be left in a situation of having to occupy Baghdad and indeed all of Iraq. However, had the decision been made, getting Saddam would have been relatively easy.

getting bin laden is the opposite situation. we definately WANT to kill him/capture him, we just can't seem to find him.

its the second red cross facility to be hit, but we've also hid a UN facility in the past, as well. But come on--the Taliban have been looting/destroying these warehouses themselves since our campaign began. this doesn't justify our mistakes, but it does put them in perspective. also, the US takes great pains in choosing their targets, but when a 2000-lb bomb is hurling at the earth from miles above, even the best technology isn't gonna be perfect.

and on the idea of villages and civilians being destoryed and killed: i agree that the civilian body count should be kept at an absolute minimum. but with the taliban placing tanks and personnel in villages right next to civilians, they literally CREATE these images. we bomb their tanks near a house, or a meeting place near a mosque, and they parade dead bodies of young children around decrying the evils of the American oppressors. but what can we do? certainly we've lost the propaganda war in the region years ago, and those that hate us won't listen to us anyway--especially since the taliban spins a web of lies.

and keep this in mind: you've got the US lobbing bombs, the northern alliances using artillery, and the taliban attacking both them and our planes with anti-aircraft fire. none of the latter have hit our planes, and they need to come down SOMEWHERE. so when we see images of a village having been demolished, it could easily be from any one of these four sources (though less so from the northern alliance).

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Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

I agree with what you've said. But IMHO, regardless of the propaganda war having been lost years ago, the coalition that presently exists won't survive if there are many more errors. Some of the countries that are supporting the bombing at present, like Pakistan, are doing so against the opinion of their populations. They are not going to risk domestic upheaval just to support the USA.

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Andy Rathe

1© Osama bin Laden is a rich guy, he could bring a plastic surgery expert there if he wanted©

2© We have NO idea where bin Laden is© Since the day of Gengis Khan, Afghan people have been digging tunnels in the Afghan mountains© There are electric plants down there now, weapons, supplies, and al-Qaeda/Taliban leaders, terrorists, and soldiers© These tunnels are thousands of miles long, so it will be VERY hard© We have all seen pictures of planes bombing the mountains, well those are heat-seeking missiles looking for people in the mountain© This is the main reason the Soviets never defeated Afghanistan©

3© We KNOW we are hitting Red Cross facilities© the same Red Cross warehouse in Kabul has been directly hit a few times© We are targeting the warehouses because they have supplies in them that the Taliban could use, and we all know that we can rebuild a warehouse a few years down the road©

4© Pakistan isn't going to be in the coalition very long, the people there are angry, and 100,000 Pakistanis have crossed into Afghanistan to fight the US© Pakistan's government may be overthrown as a result of their American support, but Pakistan would be wise not to, if they ever want to get anywhere with India and that region whose name slips my mind©

5© We didn't succeed with Hussein at all, he still has weapons of mass distruction, and is now developing biological weapons, one of which is anthrax ¥The Iraqi government has confirmed it¤ After Afghanistan we will shift to somewhere else with terrorism, maybe Iraq or Syria or Sudan, or Libya© We are now starting to plan for something in the Phillipines© The future could even hold something for the Basques, Palestinians or even Iraq©

6© Yes, the Taliban is hurting their own villages, but they really don't care, and once the anti-aircraft fire gets so high, it will explode in the air© We fly too high to get hit though©

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Victory has a thousand fathers, but defeat is an orphan.

No clue who the guy pictured in my avatar is, but its a great picture nonetheless!

Do me a favour! Pakistan and it's people have a right not to support the USA if they choose to do so. It's exactly this sort of attitude that results in the USA being known as "the global bully" in many countries around the world.

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Andy Rathe

2. We have an IDEA where bin laden is, just not a particularly good one. the govt is fairly certain that he's somewhere in this massive network of caves, but even with the bunker-buster bombs we may not hit the caves very well at all. however, ever since al queda (and particularly bin laden himself) stopped using satilite (sp) phones and other forms of tracable communication, the network has relied heavily upon direct verbal communication. so if we can keep the al queda network hiding in the mountains, unable to communicate with one another or their foreign cells, they're as good as dead.

4. there is no coalition. this is a myth. the US has many separate deals with many different countries (pakistan included, of course), but the idea that there's one binding coalition that could fall apart is wrong. plus, while there are many people in pakistan who do not support the actions of the government, there really is a so-called 'silent majority' of moderate pakistani muslims who do support it (or at least, don't not support it, i guess). the region's kashmir, by the way. and i agree that this is pakistan's main reason for offering help to the US.

and here's a rather interesting theory i heard the other day (but not one i necessarily subscribe to): polling has shown that many americans feel that the point of this war is to get bin laden. this is, of course, not true--the main point is to cripple al queda and other terrorist networks. bin laden is merely a part of it. however, if bin laden was killed, the american people might not support an ongoing war, thinking 'the enemy' was defeated. so if the military had succeeded in killing bin laden, they wouldn't report it, for fear of its meaning being misconstrued by the american public.

a stupid theory, but an interesting one nonetheless.

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Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

of course pakistan has a right to this. i think his point (however well he delivered it) was that the real reason pakistan is supporting the US is that it wants our sympathy in the region in regards to pakistani-India relations. Up until now, the US has really supported india in the region, but with the help of pakistan we've shifting to a more open approach, something that will clearly help pakistan in the future (what with both countries wanting kashmir and having nukes to toy with). so his point--or at least my point--is that pakistan will lose any favorable status in the US's eyes if they cut off support. this would place them in a real pickle, since they'd have pretty much no real friends in the region.

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Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

1.The point about the ongoing war against terrorism is correct. Many people don't understand that Osama is simply a part in this thing, not the main goal. We need to kill/capture him, but that will NOT be the end of things.

2. We have an idea of were he is. We know he can't leave Afghanistan. He has to go out in the open to move from place to place. We know where he was, say, 2 days ago, by looking at tracks in the sand. By using this system, we can eventually track him.

3. Yes, we are hitting Red Cross warehouses occasionally. I guess we'll have to spend thousands of dollars more to replace the food that was there first, which we also supplied.

4. The Gulf War didn't fail! Our goal was to drive Iraq out of Kuwait, and to keep him from aking over more countries. We acomplished those goals.

5. I guess America is the only nation that will feed the people of a country who they are at war with. We probably are also are the only country who people will complain and hate, because we didn't do it perfectly. Like it or not, our goals would be acomplished much faster if we simply carpet-bombed Kabul until nothing is standing. This would not be the right thing, but the most affective.


6. Yes, Pakistan does have the right to side with the Taliban. However, if they do, they are sideing with those who want to completly destroy us. However, all they have to do is say they will not support the Taliban, and everythings ok. For instance, you don't hear about Norway doing anything, yet they are helping us simply by not helping the Taliban. Like Bush said, "You are either for us or against us".

7. Pakistan will continue to support the US. Keep in mind Andy, that the controversey loving media will only show the protesters, not the people who dislike the Taliban. We all know about the people who crossed the border, but this means that only those people think the Taliban is worth fighting for! I don't understand how individuals such as yourself can continue to bash every single thing we do to stop these people! This was the deadliest terroist attack in Englands history, as well as the U.S.!

P.S. Yes, I suppose he will contact a plastic surgeon using his Cell Phone. Then, He can have a missle shot right at him. Osama has no forms of communications on his hands! Besides, Afghanistan has problems with paved roads, let alone plastic surgery.

I haven't bashed everything that you're doing! I first wondered why jam and peanut butter were being dropped: you told me that they were standard contents of MRE's. Fine. You're also right about the media; regardless of the story they will always put on the most visually striking parts of it i.e. people demonstrating against the bombing versus the "silent majority".

They are also fair points about the lack of a coalition - it's all individual deals instead, and Kashmir. I hadn't thought of those things this way. I also do support the bombing 100% - but that doesn't mean I necessarily agree with HOW it is being done.

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Andy Rathe

Sorry, I was using exageration. I was under the impression you were against the bombing, though.

I hate how some people don't want us to attack Afghanistan, and instead spend the cash on food. Sure, that will work. Maybe if we just drop millions of dollars of food and have the Taliban take it all, they will realise how nice we are. The government hates us, dispite the fact we are their largest source of aid. Dropping just food will acomplish nothing. Besides, why are they even critizing us in the first place? Never has a war been fought in which we feed the population of the the government we are at war with! And all this "stop doing it, you are blowing up civillian targets"? Yeah, people dieng isn't good. But in an all-out war, you bomb the cities. Back in World War 2, when the allies wantef to attack the target, they bombed the whole city. Thousands od bombers would fly overhead, just dropping bombs and erasing the city of the face of the planet. One time, The Americans and British Fire-Bombed a city so much, it caused a giant swirling stom, due to the cold air coming in contact with the fire! That was war. Now, we have the media going over there, interveiwing a person. "They attacked my home! The bomb went astray and exploded on my home!" I think all the members of the media should go and interveiw the families of the thousands of people dead and buried in the World Trade Center.

We've found some common ground at last! I agree with pretty much all of this; though at the risk of us going round in circles, I still reckon that all the Western countries, especially the USA, need to be careful with how they proceed with the war. Now that carpet bombing has started, they need to be even more cautious. One wrong co-ordinate of where to carpet-bomb, and half of the Norrtern Alliance would be wiped out!

I also believe that the only way to get Bin Laden, in the long term, is to use political means. I remembered earlier today about the Pan-Am plane that exploded over Scotland in 1988. Instead of bombing Libya, where the two terrorists who planted the bomb that caused the explosion were believed to be hiding, diplomacy was used. OK, it has taken over 10 years, but the two perpetrators of what was previously one of the worst terrorist attacks on US citizens, prior to Sept. 11th of course, were brought to trail, found guilty, and jailed.

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Andy Rathe

According to all the media over here, carpet bombing started several days ago. I do also take your point about the attacks being the opening salvo of a war, as opposed to a criminal attack.

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Andy Rathe

you are correct. we've been carpet-bombing the Taliban front lines for a week now, directly helping the Northern 'Alliance.' According to them, they've been making incredible gains because of it. According to the Taliban, they've been totally ineffective. The truth is probably somewhere in between.

as for whether this is an act of war or a criminal act, i argue that its both. since it was state-sponsored (or at least state-supported, we beleive), it was an act of war. however, the nature of the crime and the targets also show that this was a criminal act. The most successful US victory in all of this would be to bring bin laden and his goons back to the states and try them in federal court. we'd be using the democratic system--everything they're against--to gain victory over them.

of course, this won't happen. in the unlikely event that we'd be able to get bin laden alive and bring him back here, i'd be impossible to publicly try him without exposing national security secrets. it'd still be nice, though.

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Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

I'm sorry. I meant carpet bombing Afghan cities-completly destroying everything-As opposed to only using extremly accurate strikes against specific targets.

Yay!!! The Northern Allience took Maz-a-ri-sharif(sp?)!!!!!!!!!!!

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STRUCK DOWN! - Erie Hardcore

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Yes, even the Taliban has confirmed that they have lost the city of Mazar-e Sharif to the Northern Alliance. As well as several provences around the city. The Northern Alliance also claimes to have captured 100 Taliban soldiers, while killing 90 in the attacks.


Now I'm gonna say something I haven't said since they took the flag out of my sig: PEACE THROUGH POWER!!!!

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That is fascinating, Thom Yorke! You are very very interesting, and very very perceptive! So interesting and so perceptive that I think we will now fight with knives!
Yeah! To the death! Photo Trip Report!

Well, another developement. According to the local newspaper, the Northern Alliance took control of the capital, Kabul. And if I remember correctly the group that controls Kabul traditionally is the ruling group. Now that the Taliban has been forced to Southern Afghanistan, it'll be very interesting to see how long it takes before the Alliance takes control of the whole contry.

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Aaron Cedoras: Thrillnetwork Story Editor
"Dead men tell no tales..."

The Northern Alliance just said they have taken over Khandahar and Jallalabad, as well as Kabul and Mazar-e Sharif! This is great! The Taliban, of course, ran away like little girls into the mountains.

Actually, I think the Taliban is headed for Kandahar, which is a city just north of the Pakistan border. I expect we will take it within the next 3 weeks.

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"Well, I hate to be a snitch, but my neighbor Homer Simpson turned a radioactive ape loose in my house. Its taken over the whole top floor."~Ned Flanders

I just saw on the news the Northern Alliance claimed they are taking them over..

This is great, but no one has been hurt right? I hope that this battle can be fought without any more bloodshed.

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The College of William and Mary Class of 2009
Delta Chi - ΔΧ

Not too many people have been killed yet. But if this turns into a guerrilla war in the mountains with the Taliban setting up boobytraps, things could get bad.

Merged with existing Afghanistan thread.

I'm very surprised, but still pleased, that the Taliban have been removed this quickly. It's great that men can shave off their beards, women can remove their face veils and travel in the same buses as men, and girls can go to school. These were all among the things that were illegal under Taliban rule.

Hopefully, the Al-Queda network and Bin Laden will follow.

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Andy Rathe

I've heard that the Taliban have taken Jalalabad AND KANDAHAR! It hasn't been verified yet though. http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapc...cks/index.html

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