June 2006 No Limits College

Yes you read right. No contest for this month. Due to continuing problems with getting done the prizes, we are going to try out something new for this month, called the NoLimits College. How does it work? It is actually very simple. You send in any NoLimits coaster to us, and you get back a detailed comment (sort of a review) from some staff members, including me. So there is no winner or loser, no best or worst ride, no competition and no rules. So there is total freedom in which ride you send in, however you should satisfy to the following constraints:

• It must be a NoLimits track file in .nltrack format, which is zipped along with all the required .3ds and texture files.
• You can send only one track for this College.
• When you sent in a track, you can not re-send it after you updated it. This is to prevent misuse of this service.
• You should be aware of possible negative feedback and not get demotivated in case you get negative feedback.
• You should not expect feedback within one or two days, it might take some time for us to write our comments.
• You should send in your track before the end of June 30.

Here are some tips for you, to make the comment you get back from us, as useful as possible.

• It is best to send in a track which is constructed the same way you normally construct your track and in which you have put the amount of time you normally spend for a track.
• It is useful to send in a track containing a part or element which you are unsure about. For example, if you think you are very bad in constructing an inverted zero-G-roll, send in a track with an inverted zero-G-roll.
• If there are parts which you are unsure about, write about that in the Track Info, so that we know what to pay special attention to.
• It is allowed to send in a track you already started building. It is also allowed to send in a track you already finished building. It is even allowed to send in a track you already uploaded on any site.
• It is allowed to send in an incomplete track, a non-working track or a non-supported track. However it is of course best for you to complete your track, as you then can get a comment on every part.

You enter your track for this college the same way you entered a track for a contest. For people who are new to this, when you upload a track to SpeedZone, there is a box saying something like "Check this box to enter your track for this month's contest". Check this box to enter your track for this College.

I wish you all good luck building. I especially ask beginners to try this, as there is now no danger of losing!

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Hmm. I like that idea. I am working on a new coaster right now. When is there a deadline? Or is there one?

Well it's a June college, so...before June ends? But you're right, I forgot to mention

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I'm in. Sounds like fun.

Oh duh!! Haha, I read the title and all, but this is the first time yall did this so i didn't know.

How does it sound like fun?

Hopefully by the time this ends my GPA will be 4.00...

I'm working on a track that isn't possible in real life (it features two tracks combining into one, using a switch track). So I'm wondering if you will look at fantasy coasters as well as realistic ones if we mainly want to building technique looked at.

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I have one ready... I just have to recheck it and than it's yours.

The good idea machine is back in motion I see.

Will you post the rates in this forum, or PM the uploader?

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Also... Will yall being this next month? July 2006 No Limits College? I am working on a coaster but I know I wont finish this month.

Depending on the success



Your choice I was thinking of PMing it, but it might be better to share it to everyone, because that way, people can learn about other people's coasters. But of course we won't make our reviews public if you don't want that to happen.

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http://www.thrillnetwork.com/speedzo....php?file=2042

Well there is my entry. Please focus mainly on smoothness. I don't care how you post the comments.

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Alright, my coaster "Wild Buffalo Run" is up. I am happy how it turned out. How long will it take us to get results back?

http://thrillnetwork.com/speedzone/view.php?file=2048

Erik, if you wouldn't mind posting letting us know whats going on with this, id be awesome to hear from ya.

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Yah, I totally forgot about this, though the site was down. Hopefully with all the down time, yall got to the ratings. lol.

Ah the site is back online. I forgot to check regularly, so I am a bit "late" I guess. Hopefully I will soon get the reviews on, shame on me for not already having done that

I have now the following files, if yours is not in this list, please let me know.

• Ksino32: mustard vs ketchup.nltrack
• Nighmare500: Beachside Bully.nltrack
• sfft2108: Wild Buffalo Run.nltrack
• steven77: Xtreme with hills.nltrack
• TimberWolfe: Glory.nltrack

I will look at these as soon as possible. Sorry for the delay.

As for August, I will not be available between the 4th and 20th of August (I'm on vacation then, a vacation without internet connection ), so I will then not be able to answer questions or do anything else here. Because of downtime, there hasn't been the opportunity to have a July contest or college or anything. Maybe we do August, maybe we don't, but if you want to be kept busy and can't think of anything to design, maybe we'll put some sort of "assignment" somewhere.

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Thanks for the update Erik. No biggie that you didn't get them completed.

Hi. I was just wondering if you are still accepting tracks. In the first post, it say June 30th was the deadline. If you still are taking them, let me know. Thanks.

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Yah, and the deadline has passed....

Can you clarify please? I asked if he was still accepting tracks and you responded "Yah, and the deadline has passed". So do you mean "yah" he is accepting tracks, or no "the deadline has passed".

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I doubt he is accepting tracks because the deadline is way past. He probably hasn't even had the time yet to look at the tracks and he is going on vacation soon so you might be able to fit a track in, but I doubt it. There will probably be another college sign up soon.

Ok. Thanks. Just making sure.

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Here are my reviews of the five tracks. I made difference between five aspects: Layout, Trackwork, Supports, Pacing, Other.



Ksino-32 Mustard vs Ketchup

LAYOUT
Mustard vs Ketchup is a small-to-medium sized dueling coaster. The dueling effect adds to the excitement. As for the rest, I think it is a simple but decent layout, but maybe a bit spacey.

TRACKWORK
The lift hill consists of one segment. Normally this should be three segments. One is bending upwards, the second and the longest is straight, and the third one bends downwards to a horizontal position or further. Look at pictures of any real-life roller coaster with lift-hill to see this. You can make a segment straight byh selecting it and hitting I.

In the bottom of the loop there is a bump. One of the reasons is a shorter segment than the others. On the left track, the control node at the end of the short segment is a bit off.
The top of the loops is not banked correctly, the angle is a bit off. The reason is that, because rel roll is used here, the angle is set to zero degrees. The track should be banked exactly upside down. In other words, the heartline goes right through the node in Top View. Now it is not going through it. Top view of the loops shows that your loops look like S shape from above, try to make it more a Z shape. To do this, move the control points for the upside-down vertex a bit sidewards. This problem occurs in both loops.

The loops are circular. Mostly loops are drop-shaped, because circular loops cause higher G-forces at the bottom.

When going from helix to hill and from hill to helix, I see bumps. The reason is that the track before the Vertex is just a helix and the track behind it is just a hill. They don't smoothly flow into another. To change this, move the control points so that the track is already going down at the vertex itself instead of only after it. As for the vertex going from the hill to the helix, make the track going up at the vertex by moving the control nodes a bit.

I encountered an unbanked curve. Curves in these types of coasters are always banked. Also, this 45 degree curve ends bumpy because the vertex is placed at the end of the curve instead of in the middle of it. You can better place it in the middle of the curve, and set the banking accordingly.

I believe the tracks are far enough away from each other to not cause handshaking from left to right track and therefore risking injured riders.

SUPPORT WORK
You might expect that I have nothing to say about supports because there is not a lot of them. I have a few comments though. First, you only used the simple supports, and the loop supports on the loops. You should use more different types of supports. Banked curves are banked because of sideways forces (centrifugal forces) on the trains. These forces should also be supported, in your coaster this is not the case. Either use A-shape supports or construct custom supports similar to A-frame supports. Look at real-life examples for this. Exception is when the helix is so close to the ground that a lot of thick simple tubes, spaced about 10 feet, is cheaper than using A-frame supports. In your coaster, this is not the case.

You have two tracks right next to each other. Supports would be a lot stronger if you connected the left and right support somehow, preferably by custom supports.

PACING
The coaster is not very fast, but it is meant to be not very fast, so that is okay. There are no super-slow spots, but at the end, nothing is really happening so this piece should be made shorter. Too much track is spent by switching sides.

OTHER
I think you used more blocks than needed for a coaster of this size. You could easily remove one of the pairs of brakes and have four trains instead of two. It might be more exciting to make the side switch not at the end but somewhere during the ride when going faster. I think you are going too slow at the end. I like the colors, with respect to the name, but why are both trains red? Either make one train yellow, or choose a third color, your current color scheme looks very un-logical to me.

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Nightmare500 - Beachside Bully

LAYOUT
Beachside Bully is a fairly small Intamin megacoaster with a out-and-back-like layout. It reminds me of the Millennium Force layout, has that been a source of inspriation?

TRACKWORK
The lift hill uses a bos-spine. That is good. The lift goes quite slow, but since the coaster is not so big, that is not a problem.
I see a lot of small segments, so you probably made your track using a track tool. That is of course no problem. The track is very smooth through the entire course. But sometimes I see very quick banking transitions. The track is heartlined correctly to my feelings.

Going up the hill right next to the bottom of the lift hill, there is a bump. The reason is that a vertex is placed right at the bending point of the S-shaped track section.

The two-spined track sectino is okay, but there are other sections of track where I think a two-spined track would be better. In particular, the last curve before the final brake.

SUPPORT WORK
The usports of the lift look very good. Although one of the colums had to be constructed in a very strange way to make place free for the track below. I am talking about the second highest one, it is not very strong, I think it should be strenghtened at both sides instead of only at one side. Like you have done with the third highest one. Secondly, it is not a problem to use tubes instead of L- and H-beams on sections that the column has go around some track. The first four "columns" supporting the lift hill seem a bit superfluous, I would have used simple supports (single tubes) there.

Supports of the rest of the track are good. Only one thing. A part of the track uses a 2-spine track. This type of track is a lot weaker so you should add more supports there. In reality, the track spines are varied because low to the ground, supports are cheaper and therefore it is cheaper to build weak track and lots of supports. High off the ground, it is cheaper to build strong track and few supports.

The low hills to and from the overbank are over-supported I think. The supports on the overbank are a bit too simple, they look like they are build in a rush.

PACING
The coaster is fairly fast, especially the two hills leading to and from the overbank are cool, as is the overbank itself. The fast transitions make it feel faster too. I think you have done a very good job at creating a small but exciting ride.

OTHER
A terrain usually adds to the ride, but I have a comment about it. The shore looks very blocky. The terrain now looks as if it was made in the Editor and not in the Terraformer. Try to make a more smooth coast line. As for the rest of the terrain, there is one hill and the rest is nearly flat. That is okay, but a few hills around wouldn't misstand I think. Trees are okay.


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Sfft2108 - Wild Buffalo Run

LAYOUT
This is a fairly large wooden coaster located on an island. I see a LOT of segments, so the track is constructed with a tool. No problem of course. The track has a very RCT-ish layout which could be done without tools, so I don't really think that using a tool has really made sense in this case. I do think the layout itself is not bad, there are a lot of cross-overs, and therefore a lot of headchoppers.
The island is quite filled, the track is fairly compact.

TRACKWORK
The track looks smooth and is heartlined correctly I think. Remind that not all wooden coasters have to be heartlined. It is of course not wrong to do it.

SUPPORT WORK
When I hit the button Clear auto supports, I don't see ANY other supports which are not deleted. So you did't do anything but hit the Build auto support button to support your coaster. Remind that the wood-magic support builder is a tool to HELP you building supports, not to do everything for you. After htiting the button, check all your supports ans strenghten where needed. And remove un-needed or unlogical supports.
I see a few low to the gruond straight sections of track, which clearly don't need side supports. You should have removed side-supports there.

PACING
I tink the track could have been faster, you stay high off the ground for most of the time, making the extra height un-needed. In real life, this would cost money but not add anything, so this will probably not be done.
Between station and lift hill, there is a quite long section, why is it there? I think it is not adding to the ride experience. The same is the case with the extra U curve leading to the final brake. I would have rotated the station 180 degrees, because on full turn less would be needed.

OTHER
The combination woodie - terrain - trees make my framerate drop, and make my Editor really slow. Option would be to reduce the detail of the terrain, or removing un-needed supports. The shape of the terrain is good, although maybe some trees on the island or a few further off-shore would not misstand.

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Steven 77 - Extreme

LAYOUT
Extreme is a shuttle coaster taking very few space in a park because all track is going in the same direction, seen from above. I see that as a positive point. There is a loop, followed by an airtime hill. These elements are gone through twice. The ends of the track are not twisted. Because of the lack of sideways going tracks, there is practically no lateral force anywhere on the track. That might be a bit boring.

TRACKWORK
The track is very smooth through the entire coaster. The only bump I saw was very minor and was at the vertex between the station and the loop. When checking in the Editor by moving backwards in 3D view using On-track view, I can see a minor bump in the loop. But that is really nit-picky. The loop has proper banking and a proper narrowing and widening of the radius. From atop, the loop looks like it should.


SUPPORT WORK
The launch section is provided with extra strong box supports, which I think is good. The airtime hill is made of box spine, with two box supports at the end. Although thought is given to this, I think the two supports are too far from each other: there is over 150 ft of track unsupported here. I suggest putting an extra support in the center, or two extra supports on 1/3 and 2/3 of this 150 ft section. Also I see no reason to not support this track, as the ground underneath it is raised. These supports would look more logically if there was a lake under the airtime hill. Now it is a waste of money because box spine is more expensive (it has to be much stronger).
On the loop, a box spine is also used, but no box supports. The supports were meant for this job, why aren't they used? Although the current loop supports are good.
For the rest of the supports, customs are used. They look good. Extra "connectors" are used on the highest supports and on the loop supports, which makes them look more realistic.
I notice underground Nodes and tubes. Are they meant for anchoring the supports? I really like the fact that this is done, but it actually does not add to the supports a lot.

PACING
The ride starts gradually and then accelerates backwards. Through the loop, it has decent speed. The ttrain is lifted a bit at the end, making the ride backways not slower than the first half.
Going backwards, the train goes through the sation and back to the back vertical spine, and stops in the statio when going forward again. That is a good point since real coasters do this very often.

OTHER
There is a terrain featuring a pattern of 2 x 3 hills. That looks very artificial and not very natural. Any terrain outside this rectangle is flat. I suggest crating more terrain outside of it, and with some more randomness. A good point is that the terrain is smooth. There are no trees, although the terrain itself is grassy.
I feel that the colors of the train do not fit those of the track.

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Timber Wolfe - Glory

LAYOUT
Glory is a large B&M type of coaster featuring a lot of inversions. The track is spaced out over a fairly large piece of ground

TRACKWORK
THe first vertex in front of the station is a bit bumpy. I think this is due to heartlining, because the heartline looks less bumpy than the track.

In the Editor, the first drop looks a bit awkward. While riding, it feels a bit too sudden at the very beginning of the first normal track segment. The loop is good.

The first dive loop is very unsmooth. There is a big bump when exiting the dive loop horizontally. The handles should be further away from the Vertex and the track should still go down at the vertex. This is done by moving up the first handle. From top view, you can not see that it is unsmooth, but from Front view it is very clear. Actually, there are two bumps, the first one is when going vertically down.

The zero G roll is smooth, as well as the helix after that.
The transition to the overbank contains a small bump.
The transition from the overbank into the corkscrews contains a small bump. The triple corkscrew itself is smooth.

In general, the elements are smooth but the transitions are not perfect. They are not dramatical, but not super smooth. The only real problem is the above mentioned unsmooth end of the dive loop.

SUPPORT WORK
The first thing I noticed was that almost all supports were custom. In general this is good.

The lift hill supports look realistic, considerein this is a B&M ride. But, the first custom supports under the lift hill are not very realistic: they are way too wide for its height. Use vertical supports or small A-frames at this height. The same goes for the second and third custom connectino to the lift hille. The fourth is high enough to feature a frame this big.

Going down the first drop, the same is the case. I have the feeling that a lot of NoLimits builders create supports in top view by clicking some track nodes and some fundamental nodes and not checking the 3D view after that, since the height of the track is totally ignored. On this coaster, this is the case with the above mentioned supports.

The supports of the loop and the dive look are good. The supports on the low curve are thinner, which is good. I however think it would have been better to rotate the two footers connected to each track node by 90 degrees, so that the supports are perpendicular to the track in Top view. Zero G roll supports are good. Then a cool helix follows, which is supported very well, as well as the overbank.

From this point toe the final brake, everytnig is in order. The first bend and the pre-lift inversion have the same height/width problem described above. But in general the supports are above average.

PACING
The track starts right away to the pre-lift inversion. I think it is a tad bit slow there. The first drop is very cool, and a bit fast. This adds to the excitement. Then follows a standard B&M beginning: a loop and a dive loop to get into the mood.
After the bend, a zero G roll follows, and then a very cool helix. It looks like a pretzel when looked at from the right position (the far end of the terrain, seen from the station). Then, an overbank follows and then three corkscrews. The part helix - overbank is a quite long part without going upside down. I think I would have added an inversion there.
A lot of B&Ms end in corkscrews, but rarely in three successive ones. The third corkscrew is going over the lift hill, which is cool. Too bad there isn't a "saying hello" between two trains.

OTHER
The terrain is filled with trees around the track. Outside the track area, there are no trees, which doesn't bother me.
What bothers me, is that there is only one train, and the coaster lacks a MCBR. It is a fairly large coaster, so reallyl more people want to ride than only 24 per cycle.

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Altogether...
I think all five tracks I reviewed here were quite good. I am not voting for a best, nor for a worst (both would be a hard

choice). But I think all five builders are very good on their way.

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Thanks for the feedback.

yeah thanks!

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