Hello, I was wondering why the ban list is so vague. For example, slnewbus was recently banned for spam, but there were no examples of spam that he made. There weren't even links to threads where his posts are/were. It would be like arresting somone for a robbery, but not even saying who the person robbed, or when or where it happened.

Who needs examples when half of what he posts is trying to spark some flames and the other half is straight spam?

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Yah. We don't need to see what he did. The admin and mod take care of that. We know he spams. We don't need an explanation why he was banned. All we need to know is that he was banned.

^I never saw any examples of his spam, so it makes no sense.

Also, what he says is usually in defense of Dorney Park, when someone insults Dorney. It's not fair to ban someone for standing for his home park. GAdv and CP fanboys get away with that all the time.

Now you are saying that since he stands up for Dorney that was spam. No one said it was spam. We don't know where the spam was so big deal. Just cause you didn't see the spam doesn't mean the mods didn't. There are two different view between members and the mods about spam, So let it go.

Good response Ma'am. I think you quoted Coasterlove there. lol. If you want to catch the spam then read up on the boards a little more. :P

Well, sometimes, the person banned isnt even told why. For example, slnewbus may not have even known which posts were considered spam, so he doesnt know what he did wrong. It seems more like drewbie was in some minor argument with slnewbus, and drewbie simply asked a mod to ban him,and hime being here for so long gets his way. It doesn't seem liek slnewbus does anything wrong, and it'd be nice to prove, at least to him, what he did wrong, if someone is going to ban him. And I don't consider making drewbie look bad a crime here on TN.

The reason why you don't see the spam he layed out on our boards is because it is moved to a place where members can't view it, only mods and admins. We do that to keep the boards "clean"of it, while being able to document it and those who put it on there.

So, you have to trust our judgement. Trust me when I say he spammed a lot. Some people saw it before it was removed...but you obviously didn't, I can see why you questioned because of that reason. Just trust us. His spam was a bunch of quick and ignorant one-liners that made no sense and just ticked off everyone. He was not banned because Drewbie suggested it. I don't even think Drewbie even suggested his ban anyways. He was not banned for standing up for a park that he loves. I only know of one site who does that (especially if it means encroaching on a "big" park), and it's not us.

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Bryan Wood Thrillnetwork Database Admin and review writer extraordinare

I was talking about "if you don't like it...leave". Even tho everyone says it, I think Coasterlove was the first to say it in a thread actually.

^ok, that makes sense, but it would make more sense if you let him see it. Perhaps he doesn't know what is considered spam, and wants to know what not to do ever again.

This is dave's sister. I'm letting dave speak since no one will let him.


This is dave (slnewbus).
First off. I was never warned EVER that I posted spam. If I posted spam, you should have brought it to my attention. It's called fairness. Trust me. (I'm taking your buzz words mods). You have to bring forth evidence and not just act. It's called courtesy. You dont just accuse someone and take action against someone and not show any evidence to back it up or not tell them that they did something wrong

Second of all. I'm one of the few that posts half decent threads. Without me, there would be hardly anything worth writing about on here.

Third of all. None of you gave me a chance to speak on my behalf. I am now, but thats because my sister has some courtesy.

Show some decency.

ok, and just like people have the right to protest, because they want to help make the country better, I have the right to speak my mind because I feel that what i say will help make ThrillNetwork better.

I have nothing to do with that quote. I simply said that Leeloo got that quote from Coasterlove. I never said it.

^If no one posted their opinions, what would there be to post?

this is dave again. In addition, is this in anyway related to when I said that the firefox ad link was spam?

Leeloo's right, guys. We've never allowed people to post their opinions about anything here. The second you do, it's ban city. We won't even bother warning you.

The thing about the ban list is that it tells who was banned and why. You needn't go any further to see why. Most of the time, their posts have been moved to a mod and admin forum for records. If you want to see his posts, click here, here, here and here. Those are examples of his spam, though you can't see them because they're in the staff forum.

slnewbus, as for posting under your sister's name, that's not cool. You could have e-mailed us and presented your case, or you could have taken it easy and sat back for two weeks. In the future, don't spam. This is why we do it.

Do you get it, guys? He wasn't banned for no reason. We gave the reason, but if we linked to specifics, you wouldn't be able to see them anyway.

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Ok, so now you have 4 links for dave to see, but he cant see them. So still, that itch on back isnt scratched: why don't you let him see the posts, so he knows not to post like that again???

I was just trying to prove that we have records that you can't see. We cannot make him see the posts, either. He knows what he posted. You can't just make a one-word post or say "SPAM" and expect it to add to the conversation.

Leeloo, you couldn't be more wrong. We allow discussion. Look at the "Ride op RANT" thread. It's gone for pages with intelligent discussion. There is a little bit of flaming, but it's not getting out of hand. This is what we've wanted all along. Yes, we allow people to disagree. But when you start flaming or just name-calling, that's beyond a discussion. It's stupidity. We don't want that.

Sarcasm is another thing. It's difficult to tell when someone is sarcastic on the Internet.

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Remember... at one point in time, we didn't even have to tell members why someone was banned. We are doing it as a courtesy (not as a requirement). We are not obliged to go into details, other than the violation type. No site is required to do that, neither do we.

We can return to the system where we don't even have to share why people were banned if you wish.

As far as being banned... you have the option to appeal it to the admins with your case via the contact us form. However, bans are rarely overturned unless the moderator obviously screwed up. I have overturned bans myself. If you find yourself in the predicament that you're permanently banned, there's still hope over time, in that you better prove you've learned from it. We've only done that twice. Evading bans only buy you more time, plus the possibility that we will contact the ISP with an abuse complaint. We have done that in the past and have succeeded in getting ISP accounts shut down.

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dave speaking:

ok Steven, I would like a straight answer to my question, rather than an essay to avoid answering it. Why am I banned? Spam is just part of the answer and the other part of the answer is showing how I was in violation (by showing the posts or at least give the text of those posts).

This isn't just for me, this is for all members. So that all members get treated fairly.

something I like to call SPAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Ads are SPAM!!!!!!

something i like to call SPAM!!!!!!!!!!!

^definitely

^good points

so what, it is still far.

These five posts are spam that have been deleted-rather sent to a place where no one can see it except us. Seriously, can you start putting complete thoughts in your posts? Also, we have past violations on signatures and flame wars that he has been warned for (within this past month). Slnewbus was sent an e-mail last night by Byron explaining his ban for the spam.

That's plenty to be justified, and you're not helping your case by evading a ban on someone else's name to whine (evading a ban is a violation of ToS and can be punishable by a permanent ban).

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Bryan Wood Thrillnetwork Database Admin and review writer extraordinare

The thing is we all do. When you register, its like getting your drivers license or permit for the first time. Your have a clean record. Everyone is treated equally.

Lets say spam is getting a ticket in this case. Your get a few points on your record. Or here, you might get watched a little closely.
Now, if you get pulled over alot for speeding/DWI/ect. you get more and more points on your record untill they take your license away for a period of time.

Its like that here. If you start to spam/flame/ect. alot, then its like getting points on your record. You can only do it so much untill it needs to be taken care of.

For driving, you can do community service/take a course to get points deducted, then you are able to drive again.
You dont spam/flame/ect. anymore, then you are fine. We all get a choice to say what we want in posts. You can either type and post it, and maybe suffer conquences, or just let it go. 1 person doesnt make up the site, its all the members and the posts we make.

So, we basically are all treated equally. We choose what to post.

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I rarely chime in here but remember that the staffs are all volunteers and we do this because we love the community. It’s not about a power trip as some of you are feeling. Also, we do take suggestions very seriously and if you want to suggest a different way of moderating spam let us know. Start a thread in this forum. That’s why it says suggestions in its title. Give it some thought and come up with a few ideas that seem fair to you.

Keep in mind that because of the popularity of these boards we do get tons of spammers that are not part of the community. Rather they are from ad/companies promoting products and any spam rules we set up have to apply to them as well.

So how about it? Come up with spam guidelines and help us out. Be constructive instead of just complaining.

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What Dave isn't telling you is that he recieved an e-mail explaining why he was banned. He also discussed it with Byron, yet he still brings it to the boards. When people are banned, they are welcome to respond to our e-mail and explain...not try to start a whine-fest on the boards (which is evading the ban we set in place).

Tell me of one internet message board that is a pure democracy like our justice system. It's not just us, it's every board. The leaders are in place for a reason, this is not a democracy. But with that being said, we are always open to suggestions to improve our community, just like Alex explained in his post on the page before.

Things are being dramatized and we haven't changed a bit. I'm tired of seeing my colleagues being treated like facist dictators. If there is a power trip or abuse of power, we will handle it ourselves. We've ousted "holier than thou" mods before and we'll probably do it again. We've been doing this the same way for a few years now, but when it happens to someone popular...everyone cries. It happens all the time. People change, times change, move on.

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Bryan Wood Thrillnetwork Database Admin and review writer extraordinare

Guys guy guys...come on now...I think we all need to remember that Thrillnetwork is a Fortune 500 company, and serious business.

If us members can get that through our little heads, then we and the mods can coexist.

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What you fail to realize is that ThrillNetwork is not the justice system. There is no need to prove anything or not. We have tangible records of what took place, be it spam, flaming or advertising. Bryan said it twice, but the way slnewbus is using his sister's username is evading a ban and may be met with concequences. He could reply to the e-mail or use the contact us form.

What many of you fail to realize is that we don't usually ban outright. We send warnings. We keep records. The people who seem to be complaining are not the members getting these messages. We send warnings or notices. If you break the rule again, we review previous cases and decide on further action or not. slnewbus was warned in the past for violations other than spamming -- one violation he did after being told and forced to stop.

And one of the posts we deleted he posted again -- just like he did before. He broke a rule, we took care of it, but he decided he was above the rules so he broke it again. Things like that call for action. This was our call for action.

It's not that big a deal, anyway. We don't not like slnewbus. He's a good member. He rarely flames, he reports posts, he adds to discussion. But when you break the rules, you will not be ignored. That's something we did so many times before. If we've changed anything, we're sticking to enforcing the rules better than we have done.

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Voyage is the best roller coaster ever.
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dave speaking:


The thing is though, when you get points on your record, you are WARNED that you are getting them. I was never warned at all. If I were told, I would have known better. I was just banned without warning.

You have been warned in the past. Quit playing the victim card here. If you have a problem, e-mail us.

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Bryan Wood Thrillnetwork Database Admin and review writer extraordinare

With that, I'm closing this.

__________________
ThrillNetwork editor emeritus
Voyage is the best roller coaster ever.
Raptor ride count - 1,146.